Question about WR/TE vs RB

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bigdog
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Question about WR/TE vs RB

Postby bigdog » Wed Aug 09, 2017 2:40 pm

Ok, so I play in a league that weights scoring for RB the same as WR/TE. This league also allows you to start 3RB/2WR or 2RB/3WR. There are 14 teams in the league.

So what is more valuable? RB or WR/TE? Or do you draft best available, no matter what position it is, until you fill out a starting lineup in either way?

I have trouble with this league every year. It almost seems as if the only way to truly do well is to just have luck (and no not andrew) on your side. I suppose the best way to approach this one is to just draft best available at those positions. Any thoughts?
QB – R.Wilson,J.McCown,D.Watson***
RB – D.Martin,D.Lewis,R.Burkhead,T.Cohen,J.Stewart,Jon Williams**,C.McCaffrey***,J.Howard**, D.Cobb*
WR/TE – D.Adams,S.Diggs,M.Crabtree,M.Lee,V.Davis,J.Reed,C.Clay,J.Strong*
K – H.Butker,J.Lambo
DEF – Chiefs, Broncos
* - Free Keeper until ’17,** - Free Keeper until ’18,*** - Free Keeper until ‘19

4 pts – pass td , -0.5 for int
6 pts – rush/rec td
0.5 pts - ppr
1 pt – 45 yds pass, 2 pt bonus @ 300 yds
1 pt – 15 yards rush/rec,1 pt bonus @ 100 yds rush,3 pt bonus @ 100 yds rec

Docjr
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Re: Question about WR/TE vs RB

Postby Docjr » Wed Aug 09, 2017 5:26 pm

What does your mvp board say? This doesn't seem to be too far off a normal starting line up to me.
My post count says I'm a rookie, but I've been giving bad advice here for years!

ProfPoobah
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Re: Question about WR/TE vs RB

Postby ProfPoobah » Wed Aug 09, 2017 6:33 pm

My previous experiences in large leagues tell me that it's harder to find quality starters at RB than WR, in an average year, especially if TE count as WR. I think I would try and have my 3rd RB before my 3rd WR, but that's not always how the draft board plays out. Value is always the ultimate tiebreaker.

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Hornsfan78
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Re: Question about WR/TE vs RB

Postby Hornsfan78 » Thu Aug 10, 2017 11:17 am

Set your MVP Board for 2RB, 2WR and a flex and see what it tells you. I would assume that WR 29 - 42 are going to be projected for more points than RB 29 - 42, meaning you are more likely going to want to start a WR as flex more often than not. That being said, you may want to set your board for 2RB and 3WR (no flex) and see what that looks like. It may give you a better draft plan. Good Luck!
2016 Champion 9 Hot Dogs & a Taco and DS Keeper League
9 Hot Dogs & a Taco
10 Team Keeper league
'17 Draft Round (x) *=Keepers
QBs: R Wilson (4),
RBs:*Da Johnson (18) *E Elliott (1) *J Howard (20) A Kamara (16) Rawls (WW) Darkwa (WW) Burkhead (WW)
Woodhead (WW) C Carson (WW)
WRs: *K Benjamin (19) A Cooper (2) G Tate (3) D Jax (5) J Doctson (WW) C Davis (WW) C Coleman (WW)
TE: *T Kelce (7)

Start 1QB, 2RB, 3WR, Flex, TE, DEF, K
1pt per 10 ru/re 25 pa; All TD's 6pts

skiballs68
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Re: Question about WR/TE vs RB

Postby skiballs68 » Thu Aug 10, 2017 2:32 pm

If I'm reading this right, there is no designated TE position. That makes TEs mostly worthless outside of a couple elite guys. And something tells me they get overvalued in the draft just because ppl are accustomed to drafting at least one.

The description of score weighting leaves me a little confused, but I'd look at this as supply/demand question. I think you need to target a couple RBs that project for high touch volume if you can, in the opening rounds. The WR position is extremely deep, and I think you can build out a solid weekly floor of targets with some upside by aiming at guys like E. Sanders, Diggs, Maclin, etc. I'd probably fade the TE position entirely.

Other alternative is to go Zero RB, if you're in a position where you're looking at elite WRs but high risk 2nd tier backs like Howard and Ajayi as your RB1. Grab a steady "floor" RB like Gore later and pair up with PPR dynamo like Riddick. That's after you've got your 3 WRs. Draft for upside later targeting receiving RBs in time shares with potential for big workloads if injury strikes: Duke Johnson, Prosise, Washington sound like good names.

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bigdog
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Re: Question about WR/TE vs RB

Postby bigdog » Mon Aug 14, 2017 12:39 pm

To clarify the scoring, I mean both categories of player(s) are identical. Meaning 1 pt per 10 yards rushing or receiving, 1 PPR, 6 pts for a rushing or receiving touchdown.

I get the idea of using the MVP board, and I don't have an issue with that. However, I have found, more often than not in this league, that the MVP board becomes less valuable, usually quite early on. Maybe its the "homers" picking their favorite players, maybe its the "runs" on certain positions, maybe its the 14 teams that does it.

Its not getting "sucked into" a run either. Lets say you pick #1. Theres 26 more players that go off by the end of round 2. Then you go by the "MVP" board and take your RB or WR or whatever the next 2 picks. Then 26 more go. At some point somebody starts taking their 3rd qb...sometimes you get stuck holding the jay cutler "bag" because their is garbage out there.

On top of this, the league players almost never trade, and with how the waivers work, if anyone good is dropped, it seems difficult to pick them up, unless your team is really that bad.

I've tried all the perfect draft stuff and it just has never seemed to help either. The one time I did well, I lucked into it be having some unknown types have good years and then I ended up losing a playoff game because the league software allowed me to do something that was against the rules, and I did not have a full understanding of this.
QB – R.Wilson,J.McCown,D.Watson***
RB – D.Martin,D.Lewis,R.Burkhead,T.Cohen,J.Stewart,Jon Williams**,C.McCaffrey***,J.Howard**, D.Cobb*
WR/TE – D.Adams,S.Diggs,M.Crabtree,M.Lee,V.Davis,J.Reed,C.Clay,J.Strong*
K – H.Butker,J.Lambo
DEF – Chiefs, Broncos
* - Free Keeper until ’17,** - Free Keeper until ’18,*** - Free Keeper until ‘19

4 pts – pass td , -0.5 for int
6 pts – rush/rec td
0.5 pts - ppr
1 pt – 45 yds pass, 2 pt bonus @ 300 yds
1 pt – 15 yards rush/rec,1 pt bonus @ 100 yds rush,3 pt bonus @ 100 yds rec

skiballs68
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Re: Question about WR/TE vs RB

Postby skiballs68 » Mon Aug 14, 2017 7:29 pm

bigdog wrote:To clarify the scoring, I mean both categories of player(s) are identical. Meaning 1 pt per 10 yards rushing or receiving, 1 PPR, 6 pts for a rushing or receiving touchdown.

I get the idea of using the MVP board, and I don't have an issue with that. However, I have found, more often than not in this league, that the MVP board becomes less valuable, usually quite early on. Maybe its the "homers" picking their favorite players, maybe its the "runs" on certain positions, maybe its the 14 teams that does it.

Its not getting "sucked into" a run either. Lets say you pick #1. Theres 26 more players that go off by the end of round 2. Then you go by the "MVP" board and take your RB or WR or whatever the next 2 picks. Then 26 more go. At some point somebody starts taking their 3rd qb...sometimes you get stuck holding the jay cutler "bag" because their is garbage out there.

On top of this, the league players almost never trade, and with how the waivers work, if anyone good is dropped, it seems difficult to pick them up, unless your team is really that bad.

I've tried all the perfect draft stuff and it just has never seemed to help either. The one time I did well, I lucked into it be having some unknown types have good years and then I ended up losing a playoff game because the league software allowed me to do something that was against the rules, and I did not have a full understanding of this.


I think you've got to "wait" on the QB and TE positions. Since you can play WR as your flex, that's the position to prioritize in a PPR league. Your first pick or two is going to be dictated by your draft position. But once you're in round 3 things start to get pretty wide open. Round 3 doesn't really have many obvious picks.

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Re: Question about WR/TE vs RB

Postby ProfPoobah » Tue Aug 15, 2017 1:55 pm

skiballs68 wrote:If I'm reading this right, there is no designated TE position. That makes TEs mostly worthless outside of a couple elite guys. And something tells me they get overvalued in the draft just because ppl are accustomed to drafting at least one.

The description of score weighting leaves me a little confused, but I'd look at this as supply/demand question. I think you need to target a couple RBs that project for high touch volume if you can, in the opening rounds. The WR position is extremely deep, and I think you can build out a solid weekly floor of targets with some upside by aiming at guys like E. Sanders, Diggs, Maclin, etc. I'd probably fade the TE position entirely.


Whereas these two things just further enhance my opinion that getting a 3rd RB before the 3rd WR/TE is a viable strategy. WR is very deep, and people will be throwing TE in there to boot, possibly overdrafting some and pushing better WR down the board.

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bigdog
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Re: Question about WR/TE vs RB

Postby bigdog » Wed Aug 16, 2017 12:30 pm

So looks like I am picking 9th out of 14 teams. Which doesn't seem terrible but doesn't seem great either. What I do know is that the guy picking 8th is going to take Rodgers at the 1-2 turn, but he does it almost every year. Even if he doesn't this year, I know there will be a run on top qb talent prior to my 3-4 turn.

FWIW, QB scoring is 1 pt per 25, 4 for a passing td, and -2 for interceptions, 1 pt for a 2 pt conversion.
QB – R.Wilson,J.McCown,D.Watson***
RB – D.Martin,D.Lewis,R.Burkhead,T.Cohen,J.Stewart,Jon Williams**,C.McCaffrey***,J.Howard**, D.Cobb*
WR/TE – D.Adams,S.Diggs,M.Crabtree,M.Lee,V.Davis,J.Reed,C.Clay,J.Strong*
K – H.Butker,J.Lambo
DEF – Chiefs, Broncos
* - Free Keeper until ’17,** - Free Keeper until ’18,*** - Free Keeper until ‘19

4 pts – pass td , -0.5 for int
6 pts – rush/rec td
0.5 pts - ppr
1 pt – 45 yds pass, 2 pt bonus @ 300 yds
1 pt – 15 yards rush/rec,1 pt bonus @ 100 yds rush,3 pt bonus @ 100 yds rec

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bigdog
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Re: Question about WR/TE vs RB

Postby bigdog » Thu Aug 24, 2017 12:13 pm

A very strange thing happened in my 12 team league this year. The one that is posted below in my signature. The shear number of TE's taken was staggering. For a theory that says they are only maybe 3 or 4 TE that are worth taking, because in our league TE play the same as WR no dedicated TE spot, I was amazed at how many went. I want to say I counted something like 18 drafted TE's.

Now maybe that is due to our 3 keepers and our rookie system (essentially another 6 keepers, but only 2 from the current season and each of the last 2 seasons), but I don't recall a time that many went off the board. Usually there is that one guy that drafts more TE than WR, but even so thats like 5, and 2 of them might be good.
QB – R.Wilson,J.McCown,D.Watson***
RB – D.Martin,D.Lewis,R.Burkhead,T.Cohen,J.Stewart,Jon Williams**,C.McCaffrey***,J.Howard**, D.Cobb*
WR/TE – D.Adams,S.Diggs,M.Crabtree,M.Lee,V.Davis,J.Reed,C.Clay,J.Strong*
K – H.Butker,J.Lambo
DEF – Chiefs, Broncos
* - Free Keeper until ’17,** - Free Keeper until ’18,*** - Free Keeper until ‘19

4 pts – pass td , -0.5 for int
6 pts – rush/rec td
0.5 pts - ppr
1 pt – 45 yds pass, 2 pt bonus @ 300 yds
1 pt – 15 yards rush/rec,1 pt bonus @ 100 yds rush,3 pt bonus @ 100 yds rec

skiballs68
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Re: Question about WR/TE vs RB

Postby skiballs68 » Thu Aug 24, 2017 5:21 pm

bigdog wrote:A very strange thing happened in my 12 team league this year. The one that is posted below in my signature. The shear number of TE's taken was staggering. For a theory that says they are only maybe 3 or 4 TE that are worth taking, because in our league TE play the same as WR no dedicated TE spot, I was amazed at how many went. I want to say I counted something like 18 drafted TE's.

Now maybe that is due to our 3 keepers and our rookie system (essentially another 6 keepers, but only 2 from the current season and each of the last 2 seasons), but I don't recall a time that many went off the board. Usually there is that one guy that drafts more TE than WR, but even so thats like 5, and 2 of them might be good.


For what it's worth, I think you did the right thing by only rostering one of the elite TEs and then fading the position entirely.

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bigdog
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Re: Question about WR/TE vs RB

Postby bigdog » Thu Aug 24, 2017 7:05 pm

Actually I have 2. Reed and Bennett. But the pack is my team so that explains my shares there. And I've had teams that have had more than that lol. But I lot of the reason strictly came from the draft board too.
QB – R.Wilson,J.McCown,D.Watson***
RB – D.Martin,D.Lewis,R.Burkhead,T.Cohen,J.Stewart,Jon Williams**,C.McCaffrey***,J.Howard**, D.Cobb*
WR/TE – D.Adams,S.Diggs,M.Crabtree,M.Lee,V.Davis,J.Reed,C.Clay,J.Strong*
K – H.Butker,J.Lambo
DEF – Chiefs, Broncos
* - Free Keeper until ’17,** - Free Keeper until ’18,*** - Free Keeper until ‘19

4 pts – pass td , -0.5 for int
6 pts – rush/rec td
0.5 pts - ppr
1 pt – 45 yds pass, 2 pt bonus @ 300 yds
1 pt – 15 yards rush/rec,1 pt bonus @ 100 yds rush,3 pt bonus @ 100 yds rec


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